|
Left some things a little late
I suspect I'm not dissimilar to quite a few folks who hang out around here, read the gold stocks and general discussion boards frequently and perhaps post occasionally.
For at least a couple of years my brain has been completely convinced by analytical reasoning that a smash is coming, but somehow I didn't quite really believe it. Even now, when the writing is all over the wall, it is hard to accept - I mean to really genuinely accept and believe - that things will change so quickly as my brain tells me they must. I keep thinking that I'll just wake up tomorrow and everything will be fixed and I will be able to carry on as normal. This odd psychological state of mind has meant that while I have prepared, I have done it in a rather disorganized way. I have always somehow avoided making a hard plan, but just taken random actions that seem to fit in with a general preparedness goal when they occured to me. Now, given recent events, I'm beginning to wonder what I haven't done and wanted to share with some of you experts where I'm at, and get some tips on what are the most important things to take care of next. I am responsible for me, my wife and three young children. Finances I'm in pretty good shape here. I own a good amount of gold and silver. Most of it is abroad (goldmoney, bullionvault etc.), but I have plenty enough on hand for barter/survival purposes. I also have some FRNs on hand in case the banks close short term. Family/friends I have discussed the current situation with various family and friends over the last couple of years and several of them share my concerns to some degree. In particular I have both a brother-in-law and perhaps another friend who are open to a joint bug out plan. Shelter I currently live in a suburban house on a 1/3 acre plot. However much of that is very shady and not really very suitable for growing much of anything. I seem to have four options in the event that TSHTF 1. Stay where I am - Northern VA suburbs - and try and make a go of it. 2. My brother-in-law mentioned above has a grandmother with a farm (unknown size) in Indiana where he expects to gather his family and his wife's family. He is planning to talk about this with his grandmother this week (he may already have done so), but expects her to be very much on board (she lived through the great depression herself). This would be a tight squeeze for the house - we might have 30+ people there and would likely need to build another one - but we would have a good sized group of mostly capable people with some good skills. No doctor though. Also it's quite a long way to drive to Indiana, which may present some problems in getting all my preps (currently stored in N VA) there. 3. My friend (mentioned above) has 10 acres on a river in the tidewater area - much closer than Indiana. Good boat access to Chesapeake bay and the sea. We've discussed the economic situation in general terms and he's told me we'd always be welcome if things got really bad - but I'm not sure he's really, really expecting to have to deliver on that... 4. I could purchase some rural land myself - this could be here in the US or outside. While I am a permanent resident of the US and a huge admirer of the philosophy and bravery of the men who founded this nation, I am not a citizen and do not feel compelled to save her from herself - so any decision re inside/outside the US would be governed by what's in the best interest of my family. If I was purchasing land myself, I would still be able to pull together a smaller family and friends group. I was thinking Tennessee might be a good place. I could do a cash out refinanace on my current house and get about $300 - $400K to buy another place outright. Water I have very little water stored. We have a 55 gallon hot water tank - and I have maybe a hundred 750 ml bottles of San Pellegrino. I do have a Berkey water filter with two spare filters, and there is a creek about a couple of hundred yards from my house which runs most of the year (goes dry ocaasionally for a few days if we have a dry spell in the middle of summer). I have no idea if filtered creek water is really drinkable though. Food 500 lbs of wheat vacuum sealed in pails (have a hand mill - never used it though) 350 lbs of rice still in its original sacks (a few months old - I have pails and mylar bags - just haven't got around to storing it properly - can I still do so now?) 216 tins of spam 500-600 tins of assorted beans, chick peas, green beans, corn, tuna, salmon, turkey, chili, chicken soup, tomatoes, pineapple, peaches 50 lbs shortening 100 lbs dried milk 50 lbs honey 50 lbs sugar 6 gallons oil yeast (two costco packs - maybe a pound or two each) 6 lbs salt pepper few lbs baking powder few large bottles of tomato ketchup probably missed a few items here, but I think this is most of it Transportation 60 gallons of gas Three vehicles - family saloon, minivan, small SUV. No trailer, and no vehicle is even equipped with a tow hitch. Other One cord of firewood Half a sack of phatwood (this is unbelievably good for starting fires) Lots of matches Dozens of AA and AAA batteries (my wife just seems to buy these in bulk :-)) More than the usual amount of general hosuehold supplies (TP, soap etc. - again my wife just like to buy in bulk - but we probably would run out on a few weeks, maybe months) Roadside first aid kit + a little more than usual of regular household first aid suppies (bandages, hydrogen peroxide, antibiotic ointment, imodium pills, calamine lotion) but nothing more than that. non-hybrid seeds (Ark institute) purchased earlier this year and just stored in an envelope on my bookcase (how long will these stay good for?) Fairly good set of books on country living / gardening / canning / root cellaring (all unread though) Other things that have crossed my mind, but I don't have yet are: *generator (but are these really useful given how much fuel they consume?) *rabbits / chickens *mason jars *rope *string *chicken wire *tools (I have very few tools beyond hammer, pliers, wrench and drill for very minor house jobs. I also have no carpentry or mechanical skills myself, but I can always learn) *small trailer and tow hitch *Main line battle tank (see http://www.tanksforsale.co.uk/Tanks_...s_for_sale.htm) - I'm not really serious here - but the small boy inside me really does want one and you can pick up a T70 for about $60K - or at least you could a year ago :-) *sailboat (could keep at tidewater friend's place, but I don't know how to sail) *wood-burning stove (currently have no real way to cook without power except a tiny propane camping grill). * barter goods As a first step, my brother-in-law and I have agreed that we will sit the family down at thanksgiving and discuss options with everybody. Well - that's all folks - all comments and advice much appreciated. Thanks in advance, RebelYell |
Re: Left some things a little late
work on the water. possibly a couple of hundred yards of black poly pipe
12 volt pump that you can run from battery or solar panels. dont know if a well is a possibility?and can you hide the poly pipe and pump? rain catchment?and more storage i think bigger is better. the poly pipe and pump should only run a couple of hundred dollars for a basic setup, more if you are going to want/need more batteries or solar gear. i have one that i drive my pickup or tractor to at the pond and hook up to the battery to pump small amounts of water say 50 to 100 gallons at a time this way the battery is never overly discharged. i dont need to run the motor while i do this. |
Re: Left some things a little late
Many of us are in the same boat. It wasn't so much that I didn't want to be prepped more but that for me it is financial limitations. I only really woke up about 3 1/2 years ago and being young didn't really have the equity to work with that some others might have. I have done what I can do and am not particularly worried for myself but I worry for friends and family they are unwilling to prep even the ones that sort of know what is going on.
If I were you Rebel I would just sell the house outright and move but your wife would probably not agree? Seems like lots of people on this forum are hindered by spouses that do not really see it their way. All I can say is do what you can do. I will do what I can for my family and friends even though they haven't listened. |
Re: Left some things a little late
Hey Rebel,
One thing to consider (that I have been myself) is growing with aquaponics in the backyard. I have heard it is one of the better ways to maximize your space. Just a thought. Good luck with the last minute preps, many of us are in the same boat. My thoughts are that we still have quite a while before anything to serious happens but at the same time one black swan and things could get ugly FAST. Cheers |
Re: Left some things a little late
Stand. Move when you need to. It'll be the "in" thing to do anyway. Your rice is fine, get it set up. Calculate the fuel requirement for your SUV and van for a bug out +10%. Preserve it and keep it on hand. Put the feelers out on the Indiana thing to be sure that's a proper destination.
Water is your #1 issue. |
Re: Left some things a little late
A TANK?!?!
|
Re: Left some things a little late
On water I think if you just got about 1k gallon water storage tank to carry you over any dry creek period, plus simple roof collection you could be fine fast. That Berk was designed to scoop water out of nasty places and make it fit to drink.
Run the rice through the freezer to kill off any weevils then promptly vacuum seal it or other long term method. The farm sounds ideal. Your budget sounds adequate to put your family a cheap used trailer there now so you would have a supply storage place and private quarters till you could build. If there is a tractor, and your budget and skills can swing some concrete (and the water table allows) building a root cellar for supplies keeps them at a nice temperature for long storage life. You have a small community there which is a huge advantage if you don't drive each other nuts from overcrowding. You could split your supplies between locations till you made the move. Put a trailer hitch on the SUV so you can take a good bit. I really like the 30 family members plus grandma who knows how to do stuff even if her body makes her a teacher not a doer. If you choose the farm, getting henhouse and fences up to ready to go would be good projects. As soon as any able bodied make the move, get some black australorpes. If there is enough good pasture 2 brown swiss heifers. 30 acres can be more than plenty or not nearly enough according to the land. For sure do not overgraze and every ag agent estimate is too high for best land and animal care. Brown Swiss can make a lot of milk and cream (butter) on nothing but mediocre grass, and the boys are big and beefy. Cows are herd animals and are miserable solo. That is the why of 2 if possible. You do have to cut them hay for winter. Or trade for hay, or hay baling by a neighbor, with extra milk. Goats, IMO, are too much trouble to fence. If your land can only support them for milk and meat you need a great herd dog. Besides, no butter. Grow your hen feed: millet, corn etc, plus they graze too. Me too on the knew it was coming but it still feels surreal. And there is always something more to get. This long time of still being able to prepare is a blessing, but it feels really strange. |
Re: Left some things a little late
Rebel,
You dont mention firearms...where do you stand on that? I am also in NoVa....I also have Family connections in Indiana. PM me if you like and we can discusssome other possible options. |
Re: Left some things a little late
Quote:
Unfortunately, with children, you don't have the luxury of being wrong.....or they suffer for your lack of planning/actions....you MUST error on the side of caution if you error at all. Quote:
Quote:
IF, however, the SHTF tomorrow morning, you are REFUGEE.....and not much better off than the rest of the REFUGEES of the world. Only the truly strong, or the most invisible, survive. Quote:
The bottom line is, IF you REALLY think something is going to happen, start looking at other options. You do NOT want to be in a subdivision within 1/2 tank of gasoline of the refugees that will stream out of that heavily populated corridor from DC up thru NYC. I'm not going to pick thru your Water-Other categories because it simply doesn't matter.....you can add this or that, but the bottom line is you have no more survivability than the last can of spam + 2 weeks.......so it's simply a matter of deciding "how long will the SHTF last" and decide whether you can make it on your stored supplies. Do a little test.....tonight, cut your power, water, etc OFF and see how things are by Sunday night.....an even better test would be a week and your fresh stuff is gone......got a way to turn that grain and yeast into bread ? Spend Saturday and Sunday hauling water from that creek.....no, really, just try it. 2. Probably the most survivable of the 4 you listed.....but you need to get serious about it if you pick that one. Go meet Grannie....see the land.....see what you can do to start making it available to you and yours...HELP Grannie out financially, or something........don't wait until the need arises and THEN try to develope a relationship. The VERY best situation would be you MOVE there soon....or very close to it.....assuming whatever you do for employment would allow that....or change that even. 3. Same as above. If you pick this one, go down and see the land....get serious about talking with your friend in terms of you moving there.....see what you can do about housing, for example, can you build a structure HE could use, and yet you could have a small living quarters in, like a barn with an overhead apartment/loft.....and YOU pay for it......don't simply plan to show up with your tiny bit of supplies and be welcomed with open arms when the world goes to crap......YOU have to have something to offer.....and do it now. 4. Not a serious option, IMHO. "Bugout" locations that people never live on ( "I have this hunting cabin on couple acres in WestVA" ) are simply foolish.....again, you have no more survivability than the amount of "stuff" you can haul with you to get there.....assuming you CAN get there, and assuming SOMEBODY ELSE isn't already living there.....the internet is chock full of fictional stories where someone does this, bugging out to a remote location pre-stocked with enough stuff to open a Walmart, an Exxon gas station and a Cabella's all at the same time....but in reality, that's BS. If you're going to buy land somewhere as a "fall back" plan, then SELL YOUR HOUSE NOW, and go LIVE THERE NOW......it takes a long time to develope neighbor relations, to learn to raise food on your place, etc.....time you may well NOT have in a SHTF situation. Starving to death in the woods doesn't beat starving to death in a subdivision.....except maybe the view is prettier.... :biggrin: |
Re: Left some things a little late
You might also consider buying a good Dutch oven. They're cast iron and you can cook with them in a campfire and/or by putting charcoal briquettes under and then some on top of the lid.
When it's hot in the summer and I don't want to heat up the kitchen I cook quite a few dutch oven meals on the back patio. |
Re: Left some things a little late
Quote:
|
Re: Left some things a little late
I take my little dutch oven and put it in my wood stove. Obviously with the coals burned way down. I've never had problems doing this. Has anybody else done that?
s |
Re: Left some things a little late
That's a very interesting idea, Squirrel Bait.
What are the temps on the wood stove when you put the dutch oven in? The thermometer on ours can get in excess of 1000F when running hot. Do you put some of the hot coals on top for top heat as well? I usually just cook on top of the stove when I don't feel like running the electric, but a little dutch oven may make it possible to bake in it as well! What an awesome idea you came up with! |
Re: Left some things a little late
here is a url for a inexpensive but effective water testing kit.. You can test the water from the stream so you have a better idea of what you are dealing with as far as filtration goes..
http://www.h2okits.com/site/1286521/product/WS-425B |
Re: Left some things a little late
Quote:
I haven't done this for a while as I have moved into a new house and I don't have the woodstove going yet. But at least I can always cook something. You say your stove can get excess of 1000 F? Where is your thermometer? That seems way too hot!! Or do you have one with a probe that actually measures the temp inside the stack? http://www.northlineexpress.com/imag...CN-3-4-xlg.jpg sb |
Re: Left some things a little late
The stove has a catalyst which burns the smoke for an additional kick, and the thermometer measure the temp inside the catalyst. I don't know the temp in the stack, but on the top of the stove as long as the water pots are uncovered things don't boil over. The temps still scare me though--I would like to update the chimney flue. A thermometer there would be a welcome addition. Inside the stove I've seen temps as high as 1200 recently.
The stove is awesome. We haven't run the gas furnace yet this season. A couple winters ago we even asked the company to turn the gas off because we found a possibly dangerous problem with the prior installation. The gas company came out in January and kept asking, "Are you sure???" |
Re: Left some things a little late
What kind of stove is it? How cold does it get in your neck of the woods?
Quote:
|
Re: Left some things a little late
That's a lot of spam.
Ever tried eating the stuff? When you said canned beans and peas, did you mean dried or cans like you'd buy in the store? The dried ones are a lot less expensive and will store much longer. I'd say that if you wait till an economic collapse to try to move to indiana, it will be to far to try to go at that point. For example, how would you carry all that food? I certainly wouldn't take on more debt to buy a farm. Is there some way you could find a small farm and sell the current place and just move and be free and clear on the small farm? You don't want to be owing money if your job goes away. I'd want pv solar or wind power to avoid grid dependence, and my own water supply, as well as land enough to grow food and raise a few farm animals for meat and fuel. I'd think that in Va a well designed passive solar home would need very little supplemental heating. Probably pie in the sky dreams there, though, as you'd never find such a place for sale cheap... |
Re: Left some things a little late
Quote:
We live in Nebraska and in the real winter (Jan and Feb) typical daytime temps are in the 20s to 30s Fahrenheit. Occasionally we may get sub zeros, but this is rare. When it gets really cold we bundle up sweaters indoors, and I routinely have everyone use an electric blanket on low at night all winter so we don't need to heat the house or worry about how a new fire is progressing. When feeling frugal (which is any time that I have the time) we humidify the house with a tea-kettle propped open and our washed laundry hanging on lines near the stove. If things got bad (TSHTF scenarios) we would all just have to sleep nearer the stove. |
Re: Left some things a little late
I would leave the suburbs, personally. They become a death trap during SHTF scenarios. Not to mention all the annoying as hell HOA and neighbors who are constantly trying to snitch on every little thing you do.
Buy a rural plot, with at least an acre minimum. Put in a well for water. Start a garden. Plant some fruit trees. Install a renewable energy electric supply. Go off the grid, essentially. Pay off the home as fast as possible. Have 5 months living expenses in gold/silver Have 6 months worth of food stored away Have 6 months of DRINKING water stored away As for work you can rent a cheap apartment in the city and commute using a high MPG motorcycle like the honda rebel. Not sure how feasible that would be for you though, seeing as how you have a family. I'd say prepping is 10x as difficult with a family. Disagreements with spouse, kids going to school, and more expenses. |
Re: Left some things a little late
I've obtained two two quart dutch ovens (the two of them should fit handily inside our wood-burning stove) and started preparing some bread dough to give Squirrel Bait's cooking inside the woodstove a shot. Here's the recipe that I'm trying, courtesy of the New York Times. I'm going to have to cut it in half for the two two-quart dutch ovens of course.
Quote:
|
| All times are GMT -4. The time now is 10:02 AM. |
Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.4
Copyright ©2000 - 2010, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Copyright = None use it and Link to GIM